v2.2+ BETA 2 - Page 2

ferrency · #11 04-28-2012, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kontos

Not entirely true. Knights, if positioned properly, can charge the Bow and never be shot at.

I meant that after they charge without the bows shooting, the knights have a better than average chance of being recoiled. Yes, the knights can punch through the bows and avoid being shot. That was always the case even when they were quick killed by the bows. But when the knight recoils after combat, there's another chance for the bows to shoot it, even if the bows are also providing an overlap to another element.

Bows are clearly in more danger from being killed by knights than they used to be, that's true. But I don't think they're gimped. In order for Knights to beat a bow after being recoiled, they need to survive being shot at, enough PIPs to get back into combat, and a good combat roll. Previously, they just died.

Alan

Alex Bostwick · #12 04-28-2012, 11:01 AM

I'm just glad that Spear is getting some love. Never made sense to me that double ranks added support to Warband but not to Spear.

The Bow-Knight relationship change makes sense to me in light of the previous changes to Bow (shooting pretty much whenever).

Were Scythed Chariots not killed when doubled previously, or was this just a clarification because some dude said that it wasn't since it wasn't listed on the results table? Because that sounds like something Larry would say.

I suppose the change to Elephants being shot at was to fix the fact that Bow couldn't kill it in the last version of 2.2+ straight up.

Can't really find anything I disagree with in here, although I will still shill for the idea that Warband should be self-supporting if moving forward. It's just much cooler that way.

-A-Bos

david kuijt · #13 04-28-2012, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El' Jocko

Some kind of STD?

- Jack

That's SOOOO disturbing...

david kuijt · #14 04-28-2012, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roland Fricke

I've played the Nubian-Old Kingdom matches and the HYW French English using the new bow rules and I found both games played more evenly with the extra bow abilities. In the HYW game the English still shot the French to pieces even with no quick kill on knights.

That's our experience as well, Roland. Knights would still prefer to fight anything else other than Bow, if given a choice.

david kuijt · #15 04-28-2012, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex Bostwick

Were Scythed Chariots not killed when doubled previously, or was this just a clarification because some dude said that it wasn't since it wasn't listed on the results table? Because that sounds like something Larry would say.

Scythed Chariots in v2.2 were not killed if doubled by Artillery -- clearly an error of omission. Just fixing that little weirdness.

david kuijt · #16 04-28-2012, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kontos

Not entirely true. Knights, if positioned properly, can charge the Bow and never be shot at.

Perhaps I'm seeing something different from what you are, Frank. Suppose a line of Bow and a line of Knights are 5.5mu apart. No matter whose turn it is, the bow are going to get a shot before the Knights close. If it is the Bow turn, they move up to 2.5mu and shoot. If it is the Knight turn, the Knight cannot get into contact.

Suppose a line of Bow and a line of Knights are farther apart. The Bow player can always ensure that they end up getting a shot, no matter whose bound it is. Because if the Knight line wants to get a charge, it has to move up to within 5 mu, and if they do, the Bow line then moves forward and shoots.

The only time the Bow line might have a problem moving up to shoot is if there is terrain in the way -- and if there is, that is WAAAAY better for the Bow player than for the Knight player.

So as far as I can tell, a line of Bow fighting a line of Knights is always going to get the first shot. Because the move+shoot distance for bow (6mu) is greater than the move distance of knights (5mu). There is nothing the Knights can do about it.

El' Jocko · #17 04-28-2012, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kontos

Now that's just wrong, Jack.

Sorry, Frank. I guess I applied the wrong filter. Or to quote West Wing:

Quote:

President Josiah Bartlet: You know that line you're not supposed to cross with the President?

C.J. Cregg: I'm coming up to it?

President Josiah Bartlet: No, no, look behind you.

- Jack

Bob Santamaria · #18 04-28-2012, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El' Jocko

Some kind of STD?

- Jack

I think the more politically correct expression is now STI (infection replacing disease) - I still prefer to call it the pox.

An suggestion of venereal disease always carries a defamatory imputation in the Australian law of libel. Just saying.