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  #11  
Old 04-24-2012, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob and his dog View Post
The blog picture that Chris posts has an interesting figure on the far left. Is he holding a Trench Broom?
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-3RKiadC4NI...0/USMC4.G1.jpg
It might be the Thompson Auto-Rifle (what became the Thompson SMG). If so, that's an unfortunate choice on the sculptor's part, since none of those were used in action in WWI. It doesn't look like the other thing usually called a trench broom, the Winchester shotgun.

There's another non-rifle-armed figure over to yhe right, who appears to be carrying the Chauchat LMG/AR.
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  #12  
Old 04-24-2012, 01:56 PM
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Good call on the Chauchat , I first thought it to be a BAR. Here is a picture of a Marine and two Army men, one with a Chauchat, Good contrast between the Marine in a gray looking green uniform and the olive Army. The text in the Osprey book is below.

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~abeat.../ww1Marine.jpg



The US Army of World War I

1: Private, 3rd Division; Château-Thierry, June 1918. The rapid German advances of March to May 1918 led to several AEF divisions being released from the Allied Reserve. The 3rd and 2nd Divisions were sent to the Marne front defending the approaches to Paris to fill gaps in the French lines. Rushed in by truck, machine gunners of the 3rd Division were among the first to go into action at Château-Thierry. This rifleman wears standard AEF uniform and equipment apart from the British “Small Box Respirator” gasmask satchel high on his chest in the “ready position”. The 3rd Division would earn the sobriquet “Rock of the Marne” for its unflinching defence of this sector, both in June and especially in July. The fighting at Château-Thierry and the nearby Belleau Wood by US troops was muddled together in reports in newspapers back in the States, and to this day the US Marines with the 2nd Division are often credited for much of the fighting. The main units of the 3rd Division were (5th Bde 4th & 7th Inf, 8th MG Bn; (6th Bde 30th & 38th Inf, 9th MG Bn; (div troops 7th MG Battalion. 2: Private, 5th Marines, 2nd Division; Belleau Wood, June 1918. US Marines were among the first American troops deployed to France and they played a large part in the early history of the AEF. The 5th and 6th Marines and 6th MG Bn formed the 4th Marine Bde of the AEF 2nd Division; this formation went into the trenches in April 1918, but the Marine contingent made its reputation by its bloody headlong assault on Belleau Wood in early June. Marines initially wore this distinctive forest green P1912/17 uniform (note large patch skirt pockets with pointed flaps); but due to the logistic difficulty of resupply after the wear and tear of combat it was soon switched for the available Army drab. Indeed, the typical veteran Marine would be seen wearing nondescript Army drab without collar discs; upon close examination, Marine issue buttons, red/green rank stripes or perhaps the Corps eagle, globe and anchor (EGA) insignia might be seen from time to time. Marines also used web gear with EGA button-style snaps in limited quantities. (See also MAA 327, US Marine Corps in World War I, 1917–18.) 3: Private, 3rd Brigade, 2nd Division; Belleau Wood, June 1918. The Army’s 3rd Bde (9th & 23rd Infantry, 5th MG Bn) of the 2nd Division served alongside the USMC in the Belleau Wood sector and several companies were involved in the Marines’ fight. Perhaps chastened by the heavy casualties suffered by the Marines, the Army took longer to plan the assault on the nearby town of Vaux, which went off like a training exercise and with few casualties. This soldier of the 3rd Brigade is armed with the controversial French CSRG M1915 Chauchat light machine gun or “automatic rifle”. The bipod was often “lost” and gunners found it was usually best to hold the forward part of the weapon by cradling the magazine. Firing the “Shoo-shoo” with any reliability was more an art than a science, but with nothing better to replace it the CSRG was found useful. The Chauchat magazine bag seen here was also popular as a Doughboy haversack. Machine gunners were issued the Colt M1911 .45in semi-automatic pistol as their personal weapon.
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  #13  
Old 04-24-2012, 04:35 PM
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I was going through my blog and discovered that a lot of interest in my Marines had come from this site so I decided to peek in and see what was going on.

In reference to the link back to my site and the figure on the far left. He is also carrying the French Chauchat LMG (Shoo-Shoo). That particular unit is setup for Over the Top by Warhammer Historical. As such it is set to the maximum of 15 figures and has two Chauchat and two rifle-grenade launchers.

The Marines came to France in their standard "Forest Green" uniform which reports indicate was close to the German Feldgrau. I took Vallejo Feldgrau and a Vallejo Dark Olive and mixed them 50/50 to get the color I was looking for.

As the Marines progressed through the war they received Army uniform replacements as Pershing didn't want to burden the logistics system. So gradually you will see Marines go from their full uniform to bits and pieces of the US Army uniform and eventually to the full Army uniform for veterans. Replacement marines coming from the US would be kitted out in the original Marine uniform so units quickly developed a very ragged look.

You definitely cannot use British troops to stand in for US troops beyond the helmet the kit is very different. However, the physical differences between a Marine uniform and an Army uniform in 15mm are not going to be visible so using Army painted up as Marines would be fine. In late 1918 you would see BARs replacing the Chauchats and the Browning MG for the Hodgekiss MG.

I highly recommend the Osprey book on the US Marines #327.

Kris
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  #14  
Old 04-24-2012, 06:52 PM
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Some good discussion here, and on a subject I personally enjoy a lot - WWI. I am using Irregular British for my Americans and feel they will be fine. The differences between the web gear at 15 MM scale is not very perceptible in my mind. One conversion is needed for the officer figures to change the peaked cap to a helmet but that's an easy one to do. The Irregular line is pretty extensive, and has some nice guys to use for Trench Raiders. Additionally Ian Kay at Irregular will soon be offering prepacked core armies for HitT.

As for the Marine uniform they did indeed first appear in the war wearing their forest green uniforms. But it was soon discovered that the color in the field was very similar to the German feldgrau and caused some concern. So as replacements in clothing and men went on the Marines began to adopt the standard Army khaki, but as stated with Marine insignia. It would not be out of place to see Marines wearing a mix of the forest green and khaki, but mine will be in forest green, so as to differentiate them from the Army supporting troops in my army.
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