xeswop
07-05-2005, 02:54 PM
Below are umpire rulings based on recent input from Phil and discussions on the net
1. What does the term "such a column" in the rule:
"A group move by road, or across bad going or across any but a paltry river, must be in a single element wide column. A group move can include reducing frontage to form such a column or to pass through a gap between terrain features or troops of at least 1 element base width, following a road, or moving up to half an element base width sideways to line up with enemy within 1 element base width ahead. ..."
Phil says:
"A group can always reduce frontage to become a column. "Such a column" means "a single element wide column."
2. How is a column formed.
The DBA rules do not explain the procedure except to say
" group move can include reducing frontage to form such a column"
So forming a column is a group move that involves reducing frontage. I have asked Phil for clarification but have not gotten such. For H'con, then, we will use a working interpretation the rule below, cited by Dave Schlanger in an earlier thread on this topic. He wrote
" We could make our lives really easy, and just go to HotT for the following:
FORMING A SINGLE ELEMENT WIDE COLUMN
"The front element of the column moves forward normally. It can wheel. Other elements of the original group move as if by single element moves, the nearest elements falling in behind the column, the rest moving to close up any resulting gaps. No element can exceed its normal move distance nor end further to the rear than its previous position. Except as made necessary by wheeling part of the column to follow a road, all elements must end facing the same direction and in both edge and corner to corner contact with another element of the original group. It may take more than one move for the whole group to join in the column."
While Phil says other DB based have no relevance to DBA, we need something to tell us what to do until we get an explanation from Phil that is relevant to DBA. This is as good as anyone could make up.
3. What does "meets" mean in the rule:
"A recoiling element starting with enemy in any front edge contact with its flank or rear, or that recoils from shooting entirely on its rear edge unless from a BUA, or that meets enemy, impassable terrain, friends that it could not pass through or push back, or any BUA or camp, or that is in a BUA or camp, is destroyed.
Phil responded to a question on this as follows:
"If a recoiler's rear edge contacts enemy, it is destroyed.
If it has room to recoil but ends touching friends, it is not.
The difference is that it is destroyed by friends it cannot push back or pass through and if there is space it doesn't have to. Enemy are different because it is only necessary to touch to trigger combat. You don't push through them."
I have asked for further clarification with regard to "meeting" things other than friends and enemies but have not received such. Does touching impassable terrain have the same effect as touching friends or enemy? In the meantime we will continue to use the older interpretation
The rule means if an element is unable to complete a recoil before it would displace the element to the rear that it cannot pass through or push back, then it is destroyed. The recoiling element must be UNABLE to complete its recoil move of its own base depth (or width if less) to be destroyed. An element can always recoil within the space of its own base depth or width if less. Moreover, the rule does not refer to side to side edge contact with an enemy, so "meeting" the side of an enemy with its side does not result in the recoiler being destroyed.
4. What does "shooting entirely on its rear edge" mean in the rule cited in 3 above.
Now Phil says this applies only if all of the shooting element is behind the side extension of the target rear edge. To qualify, also, all shooters must be in that location. See here for a full discussion of shooting.
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~beattie/bmc/dbashoot2.htm
Note that I am not suggesting that any one other than those playing in events I am responsible for need follow these interpretations. Nevertheless, as always comments from anyone are welcome.
[ July 05, 2005, 13:37: Message edited by: Bob. ]
1. What does the term "such a column" in the rule:
"A group move by road, or across bad going or across any but a paltry river, must be in a single element wide column. A group move can include reducing frontage to form such a column or to pass through a gap between terrain features or troops of at least 1 element base width, following a road, or moving up to half an element base width sideways to line up with enemy within 1 element base width ahead. ..."
Phil says:
"A group can always reduce frontage to become a column. "Such a column" means "a single element wide column."
2. How is a column formed.
The DBA rules do not explain the procedure except to say
" group move can include reducing frontage to form such a column"
So forming a column is a group move that involves reducing frontage. I have asked Phil for clarification but have not gotten such. For H'con, then, we will use a working interpretation the rule below, cited by Dave Schlanger in an earlier thread on this topic. He wrote
" We could make our lives really easy, and just go to HotT for the following:
FORMING A SINGLE ELEMENT WIDE COLUMN
"The front element of the column moves forward normally. It can wheel. Other elements of the original group move as if by single element moves, the nearest elements falling in behind the column, the rest moving to close up any resulting gaps. No element can exceed its normal move distance nor end further to the rear than its previous position. Except as made necessary by wheeling part of the column to follow a road, all elements must end facing the same direction and in both edge and corner to corner contact with another element of the original group. It may take more than one move for the whole group to join in the column."
While Phil says other DB based have no relevance to DBA, we need something to tell us what to do until we get an explanation from Phil that is relevant to DBA. This is as good as anyone could make up.
3. What does "meets" mean in the rule:
"A recoiling element starting with enemy in any front edge contact with its flank or rear, or that recoils from shooting entirely on its rear edge unless from a BUA, or that meets enemy, impassable terrain, friends that it could not pass through or push back, or any BUA or camp, or that is in a BUA or camp, is destroyed.
Phil responded to a question on this as follows:
"If a recoiler's rear edge contacts enemy, it is destroyed.
If it has room to recoil but ends touching friends, it is not.
The difference is that it is destroyed by friends it cannot push back or pass through and if there is space it doesn't have to. Enemy are different because it is only necessary to touch to trigger combat. You don't push through them."
I have asked for further clarification with regard to "meeting" things other than friends and enemies but have not received such. Does touching impassable terrain have the same effect as touching friends or enemy? In the meantime we will continue to use the older interpretation
The rule means if an element is unable to complete a recoil before it would displace the element to the rear that it cannot pass through or push back, then it is destroyed. The recoiling element must be UNABLE to complete its recoil move of its own base depth (or width if less) to be destroyed. An element can always recoil within the space of its own base depth or width if less. Moreover, the rule does not refer to side to side edge contact with an enemy, so "meeting" the side of an enemy with its side does not result in the recoiler being destroyed.
4. What does "shooting entirely on its rear edge" mean in the rule cited in 3 above.
Now Phil says this applies only if all of the shooting element is behind the side extension of the target rear edge. To qualify, also, all shooters must be in that location. See here for a full discussion of shooting.
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~beattie/bmc/dbashoot2.htm
Note that I am not suggesting that any one other than those playing in events I am responsible for need follow these interpretations. Nevertheless, as always comments from anyone are welcome.
[ July 05, 2005, 13:37: Message edited by: Bob. ]